The Bad Penny (beta)

Strange as it may sound, metal band Heavy Heavy Low Low from San Jose, California enjoyed a rather effervescent and extended era between the time they formed in 2004 and went on hiatus six years later. The band had a reputation for shenanigans but was never considered malicious or destructive — simply a badass, must-see group of lads who made three records that many considered to be “screamo” essentials: 2005’s Courtside Seats…, 2005’s Everything’s Watched, Everyone’s Watching and 2008’s Turtle Nipple and the Toxic Shock.

There was certainly disappointment when the band went away in 2010, but no TMZ-worthy drama to speak of. But as their records became even more appreciated in the ensuing years, Heavy Heavy Low Low’s decision to get back in the game in 2019 was met with great joy and fanfare. The reception at their reunion shows was so positive, in fact, that it led the band to create a new studio album, Pain Olympics, that came out earlier this year. They toured extensively in support of it up till recently.

But when The Bad Penny checked in with vocalist Robbie Smith, we discovered there was far more beneath the surface of what otherwise seemed like a breeze of a reunion. Pain Olympics documents a heavy dose of grief the band members suffered through over the years and in many ways functions more as an exercise in healing than simply a comeback album. Take a seat and a few deep breaths before reading this extensive interview with Smith, a gentle and candid artist who is also a filmmaker and a genuinely good man.

Nice Aliens poster you got there on the wall behind you. What did you think of Romulus?

I dug it. I didn’t really like the fan service of using taglines from other films; they literally use a tagline from Aliens in the latter half of that film. And in the timeline, [the] Aliens [story came after Romulus].

I missed that, what was it?

“Get off her, you bitch.” With the same cadence and everything. I did like the twist toward the end, though, where they brought together Prometheus [with the new film]. That was pretty sweet. It was pretty scary, really creepy.

Are you a big horror film guy in general?

Yeah, big movie guy. Horror films are my bread and butter. But I love movies in general.

Can you rattle off a few that I probably haven’t seen that you would recommend? Anything except for rom-coms and musicals.

There’s a pretty wild movie from Mexico called New Order that came out 2023. It’s incredibly stressful but so good, so well made.

Have you seen Coherence? 

That’s the sci-fi one where they swap minds, right?

It’s a super low-budget film based around a bunch of people having dinner, and they hear that there’s a comet or an asteroid that’s going to be passing by Earth. Then they start wondering if there’s been an alien invasion that’s taken over some of the people in the room, and they can’t tell who’s who anymore. I don’t think they ever go outside the dining room. It could even be made into a play. It’s gotta be one of the cheapest great sci-fi movies, along with Primer.

I love Primer. Did you see Upstream Color, which the director of Primer made?

No. 

Check that out. He had a bigger budget, so he used more locations. It’s one of those wormhole movies where there’s so much to unpack that there’s, like, endless rewatch [potential]. And there’s an incredible score as well that he did himself. It’s really good stuff.

So, moving on, I really appreciate connecting with you. I stumbled across some post online that said you guys started playing again five years ago, and then COVID hit. Great timing. How frustrating was that?

We had posted tickets and everything, and within a few months, it was just like, “Nope, not going to happen.”

What made you feel like the timing was right back then to reunite?

I’m not sure. I think we all just got to a certain point in our adult lives where we were like, “Oh, this is feasible, to do a week-to-week thing — not touring half the year, like we used to, but … we’re not old or anything, but we were like, “Let’s do this before we get rickety.”

It’s always refreshing when a band gets back together and it doesn’t seem like they’re doing it just for the money. With so many of these reunions happening these days, some of the press releases may just as well say “easy paycheck.” You guys put out an EP around the same time you re-formed, but you had sat on it for years, right?

Yeah, that was in 2022 or something like that.

How come you held onto it for so long?

It was a live thing, and I don’t think anyone had thought about it, because a lot of the time on that recording, we’re just fucking around. [It captures us] singing joke songs. Then all these dudes would hit us up and be like, “Hey, whatever, what happened to that EP?” We found it on Sam’s computer and released it, and people seemed to like it.

As you guys played shows in 2019, you predated what’s become a real reunion trend. But did you see any other bands that had pulled it off so well that they inspired you to think you should do it too? 

So, we didn’t ever get to play before COVID. It was set in motion, but we just didn’t get to do it. [We decided to resume playing live because] we weren’t ever making money on tour or with records or anything like that [before], and then it seemed to become at least sustainable. It was just like, “Oh, we can actually break even instead of coming home in debt every single time?” That even happened when we played on Sounds of the Underground. That was brutal, because we were a younger band, a smaller band, and our guarantee wasn’t much. A lot of the time, there would be overnight drives, because the bigger bands had a bus and a driver, but the lower-tier bands were all driving themselves in a van and a trailer overnight — 10- and 13-hour drives. And load-in was at, like, 11 a.m. or noon sometimes, when we weren’t playing until 6 p.m.

I’m a big Queens of the Stone Age fan, and playing Ozzfest really tested them as a band. Was that a similar case with Heavy Heavy Low Low and Sounds of the Underground?

I don’t know. It made us a little manic, but we rode the wave. I don’t think we were ever tested to the point of breaking up. Because we were so young and everybody else on the tour — besides Devil Wears Prada — was so senior, they just felt like they could treat us however they wanted, especially with security. One security guy had it out for us all the time, and we weren’t even doing anything. It was a very peculiar tour. I guess we had some sort of reputation as a band [that engaged in] some wild antics. I have no idea why, because we’re not as wild as any other band. But this security guy made it his business to be a jerk. That’s the only way I can articulate it. 

It’s funny that a band called Heavy Heavy Low Low, which suggests such extremes, is actually rather mild-mannered. So why did you decide to part ways when you did? The reasons stated at the time it happens are usually BS, but since many years have elapsed, can you share what really happened?

We got a little … I don’t want to say tired of one another, but we just started to … you’re with a set of people for so long, there are some feelings that you don’t know how to navigate, and it just got to be too much. We were all too young to process or mediate [our discomfort with each other]. So it [devolved into] screaming matches. Alcohol had a big thing to do with it too. At this point in our lives, we’re so much more responsible and we know each other so much better, we know how to talk out [our problems], be civil and behave like grown adults. So it was that and just wanting to live a real life. Coming home back then and sleeping on a couch of a friend didn’t feel like I ever had any foothold or housing security. At the end, we were just like, “Let’s get jobs and careers. Let’s go to school. Let’s figure out [our lives].

Did you stay in touch during those years when the band was inactive?

Oh yeah, we constantly talked to one another. Once we weren’t in the band, it made it easier for us to be friends. Not that we were ever particularly not friends, but once we had all parted, it was just way easier to be like, “Hey, how are you?” 

What were you up to when the band wasn’t active? You mentioned some members of the band pursued careers and school. I assume maybe growing families too? Also, how do you feel you changed as a person during that time?

It’s interesting, because I joined the band right out of high school and we just started touring. I never got to figure myself out as an adult, ‘cause once we were in the van, in the band and all that stuff, life just went by. I  never got a chance to really ponder or even grow up because I wasn’t forced to. [During the period of dormancy,] I was just trying to figure out who I was outside the band. As I had loved movies my whole life, I decided to create short films and music videos. In 2022, I shot my first feature. And last year I shot my second feature. So that’s my thing now: movies. One is doing the festival circuit right now.

Dude, that’s great. Congratulations. Did you go to film school? 

No. YouTube teaches you pretty much everything you need to know in terms of the technical side of things. But in terms of editing and writing, I’ve seen so many movies … in the band, I had a fold-out DVD player with foreign films, and I would watch them all the time. So I just started making my own ones.

Did learning how to make movies also make you realize new approaches, techniques and ideas to the band, and specifically the new record?

I think I’ve discovered throughout this time that there are no rules. Like, there’s no set way of doing things. And the more you test boundaries and don’t toe the line, the more unique your art can be. I always felt like the band was stuck in this high, low, screechy, growly thing. I felt like if I betrayed that, then either people wouldn’t like it or people wouldn’t buy our records — which has never been [an issue] anyway.

I don’t know why I was thinking that, but yeah, with [Pain Olympics], [I felt like] I could be whoever I wanted to be. I don’t need to do metalcore or this or that. I can do exactly what I want to do and say what I, whatever I want to do and talk about serious things.

Another thing is that, with some of the older records, I felt I had to be silly or playful to a certain extent. With Pain Olympics, I wanted to bring a certain pathos or, like you said, maturity to it. And it created a different sound.

Can you be more specific?

I got a little weirder in terms of vocal delivery. There are some falsetto moments I never would have done on previous records. We had other projects in the interim between Heavy Heavy Low Low, and I started one called Bone Cutter with the bassist of Heavy Heavy Low Low [Andrew Fritter]. It was very slowcore, like Pedro the Lion, with twinkly guitars. [In that project,] I discovered a lot about my voice and the ways I could apply that to heavier music.

So, you found that it was compatible with Heavy Heavy Low Low?

Yeah. Especially with [Pain Olympics]. It’s a more melancholic record in terms of content and theme.

Can you speak more to the theme?

A lot of it’s about death, which we didn’t experience a lot of before we [split]. We felt invincible. Our friends seemed invincible. Even our family, our parents, all seemed invincible — until a certain moment. In 2019, we lost a really, really good friend to drugs. And then in 2021, we lost a really good friend who would tour with us. He took his own life. And then in 2023, I lost my dad. So a lot of [Pain Olympics] is just trying to process that and understanding that life is absurd and there’s no hard facts. We [came to] understand and came to terms with [the fact that], as we grow older, we start to deteriorate little by little.

So did you feel like you needed to make Pain Olympics to go through that grieving process? 

Yeah. My movies all deal with very heavy subject matter as well. But yeah, there are certain songs on this record that are about my dad and having him deteriorate physically, and then, slowly, mentally.

I’m very sorry to hear that, Robbie.

Thank you.

And I appreciate you sharing what you just said. I thought the song “I’m So Bad at Goodbyes” was about you guys breaking up, but now I can see how it might be about something more than that.

Yeah, that’s the main dad song.

And this also explains why the sound is more melancholic as well.

Yeah. And a little angry with that song.

I’m not an expert on grief, but did you find that reconnecting with your bandmates was an integral part of processing the grief, especially because some of the individuals you mentioned were mutual friends?

Yeah, big time. It was huge. Compared to how we used to be, we’re also [more] vulnerable and, for lack of a better word, sensitive, to each other’s feelings. So processing death with them has certainly helped.

When you finished the record, was there any sense of relief or some degree of a weight being lifted?

I don’t think so, which is unfortunate. I think that’s a myth when it comes to death. I didn’t feel that strongly about losing my grandma because she made it to 98, whereas my dad and my friends were taken [too soon]. I don’t think true catharsis [from grief] exists. It just gets more manageable. Instead of a throbbing ache, it becomes a low thrum. But it’s always there.

Do you feel like you learned something to the extent that you would feel comfortable sharing a piece of advice to someone who is beginning to go through the grieving process?

I feel like I’m the worst person for advice, but I’d say embrace it. Don’t bottle it up and push it aside. Let yourself grieve but also let the damn break. Crying is the best thing in the world in terms of feeling better. That’s the only way you’re going to do it. It’s like letting the pressure loose in a way. Eventually sadness will turn into joy, so don’t force it away.

Repression is an act of betrayal, isn’t it?

Certainly. Yeah. That said, the pain not going away is a good thing because it’s a constant reminder that [the deceased] were there, and you still have the memories.

Buy a copy of Heavy Heavy Low Low’s Pain Olympics and learn more about the group on its Bandcamp page.

This entry was posted on 09/06/2025 at 4:26 pm and is filed under Interviews with tags Heavy Heavy Low Low. You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed. You can leave a response, or trackback from your own site.